Steering Column Information

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December 30th, 2007, 05:28 PM
Grantshire

Steering Column Information

This may be old news/information to most of you but I did a little comparison between steering columns yesterday. Here are the players:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload175.jpg

The upper column with the wheel is stock M715, the black one is a Super Wagoneer tilt column and the blue one is from a 69 Commando. All are small diameter 40 spline shafts (74 and up Jeep shafts are 36 spline) and all use the Grant adapter #4403.

Here is how they measure up.

Length of tube to the collar under the steering wheel (the collar comes off the M715 tube but is made into the others).

+ M715 = 28", Super = 21 1/8", Commando = 21 1/2"

M715 column sticks out from the dash 5" to collar (can't say about the others) and the M715 column floor mount to collar is 22 5/8" & 23 3/8" (the mounting plate is tack welded on the tube at an angle. Both of the other columns have a moveable mount.

The internal parts of the steering columns are basicly the same with the exception that the Commando and Super columns have internal parts for turn signals and their cancelation function.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload157.jpg

Steering column shafts are similar with the M715 being longer than the others and the Commando shaft has the rag joint made onto the shaft.

Here is the M715 and Commando shafts:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload176.jpg

More to come...
December 30th, 2007, 05:33 PM
Grantshire

more on columns and wheels

Steering wheels:

All three have the same 16"x17" steering wheel:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload170.jpg

Steering wheel mountings are the same even though the horn designs vary.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload165.jpg

The nut that holds the steering wheel on are identical between the Commando and m715 but the Super is smaller and thinner:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload168.jpg

Horn internal mechanisms are identical:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload167.jpg

More coming...
December 30th, 2007, 05:47 PM
Grantshire

more on columns and wheels

There are some slight differences in the underside of the steering wheels but I believe they still interchange:

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload173.jpg

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload172.jpg

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload171.jpg

The M715 column protrudes through the floor about 6":

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ownload128.jpg

Why the comparison and all the measurements? I plan on putting a Super Wagoneer tilt column in my M715 for both comfort and possible seat/leg/wheel interference. Since the Super column is shorter it will have to terminate just past the floor board which will require a longer connecting shaft between the column and the steering box. it will also steepen the angle but I don't think it will cause any interference.

I suspect Commando steering wheels and steering parts are a lot easier to find than M715 parts. It is nice to know what fits and interchanges.
December 30th, 2007, 06:43 PM
Binford

Very interesting stuff. Thanks for taking the time and effort to post it all!
December 30th, 2007, 06:44 PM
gimpyrobb

What is the differance in tube sizes? Could you splice some of the 715 into the Super Wagoneer column? Then add some length to the shaft.
December 30th, 2007, 08:16 PM
randyscycle

If you want the measurements, I will go out and measure a couple of the XJ columns I have kept around too.

They are basically GM style columns with the switch built in and tilt too. The nice thing is they don't have shifter on them like so many GM columns do.

The rag joint on the manual steering boxes is a fine spline. The later P/S boxes have a coarse spline that is identical to GM. Probably because they are Saginaw stuff.
December 30th, 2007, 08:25 PM
Grantshire

Quote:

Originally Posted by gimpyrobb

What is the differance in tube sizes? Could you splice some of the 715 into the Super Wagoneer column? Then add some length to the shaft.

Diameters are the same and both are round the full length unlike the Commando column. Don't think you would need to frankenstien the two (I have not taken the Super completely apart). The Super would mount just like the M715 but would terminate just below the floorboard. All you will need is a longer shaft between the steering column and steering box. This is what I will do to put the Super Wagoneer column in my M715.

For those who wish to stay stock, I found it interesting that all steering wheels are tge same. I also think you could use the Commando column to get turn signals and emergency flashers but use the M715 shaft. That way it would look almost the same and still use the st0ck linkage.
December 30th, 2007, 08:34 PM
Grantshire

Quote:

Originally Posted by randyscycle

If you want the measurements, I will go out and measure a couple of the XJ columns I have kept around too.

They are basically GM style columns with the switch built in and tilt too. The nice thing is they don't have shifter on them like so many GM columns do.

The rag joint on the manual steering boxes is a fine spline. The later P/S boxes have a coarse spline that is identical to GM. Probably because they are Saginaw stuff.

Randy,

Jeep used a GM column up until Chrysler bought them. The diameter and spline of the shafts and tube diameters were the same up until about 74 (at least that is the pivotal year for Jeep). All later (post 73) Jeep/GM columns have larger tubes and the shafts are 36 spline as opposed to 40) so they interchange amoung each other but are different that the M715 era vehicles. They can be made to work but will require enlarging the hole under the dash.
December 31st, 2007, 02:42 PM
randyscycle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grantshire

Randy,

Jeep used a GM column up until Chrysler bought them. The diameter and spline of the shafts and tube diameters were the same up until about 74 (at least that is the pivotal year for Jeep). All later (post 73) Jeep/GM columns have larger tubes and the shafts are 36 spline as opposed to 40) so they interchange amoung each other but are different that the M715 era vehicles. They can be made to work but will require enlarging the hole under the dash.

Thanks for the clarification!
January 1st, 2008, 10:07 PM
brute4c

74 was the year the brakes went to disc and the big redesign of the FSJ happened...it is kind of the divider between early and late FSJ's...M715's interchange with the early stuff.
January 1st, 2008, 10:27 PM
Jed

I went with a new Flaming River tilt column. They are two inches in diameter and fit right inside the old column tube. I cut the old tube off on both sides of the firewall, slid the new column through, and bolted it all back up. Looks real nice. I wasn't going for the stock look though...
January 2nd, 2008, 11:02 AM
ffdemoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jed

I went with a new Flaming River tilt column. They are two inches in diameter and fit right inside the old column tube. I cut the old tube off on both sides of the firewall, slid the new column through, and bolted it all back up. Looks real nice. I wasn't going for the stock look though...

Got any pics of that?
January 2nd, 2008, 08:24 PM
Jed

Here are some shots of the Flaming River 35" tilt column

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/9038/steer2rp2.jpg

Here you can see the new column going through the old tube after I cut it off
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/5724/steer1sv5.jpg

Here is the engine compartment side of the old tube
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/6829/steer3yw3.jpg

And finally, the new u-joint on the new steering column
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/5204/steer4jr9.jpg
January 3rd, 2008, 12:38 AM
Binford

Nice bling there, Jed! ;)
January 3rd, 2008, 08:20 AM
ffdemoss

Sweet. That's a nice install.