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spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by batistabomb on Aug 5, 2006, 6:49am
can anyone please tell me or send the step by step procedures for doing the spring over/flip shackles conversion on a 1967 M715? all help would be appreciated. also let me know what other parts or supplies i'll have to have other than my factory components.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Aug 5, 2006, 12:51pm
maybe one of us can just come on over and do the swap for you too?
ok, that was harsh. What are you doing the swap for? You may need: new driveshafts, new steering components, moved spring perches, longer brake lines, different steering setups, etc etc etc
Kind of depends on what you're trying to do....
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by hetzer on Aug 5, 2006, 1:03pm
Tacoma...I think it's easy to get the impression from reading here that all you have to do is flip and bang around a bit and it's done.
I can't say for sure I've seen it all laid out info wise as to what needs to be done.
Let's say, the least you wanted to do was run bigger tires than stock. With no real information to go by other than poking around and reading " spring over and shackle flip", it can lead to the question.
I'm not to the point in being ready to do that yet, so I haven't bothered asking about it.
(I guess I'm validating his question from the FNG point of view.)
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Aug 5, 2006, 1:10pm
no, you're right. That's why I put the short list of possible other stuff needed.
There is certainly a lot more to nearly any mod than most of us let on. Usually not just "bolt one thing in and that's that."
but you make a good point.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by sermis on Aug 5, 2006, 3:46pm
Unless you just want really large tires, go with the 11.00 16 XZL's or XL's. they look really good, 38" tall.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by sermis on Aug 5, 2006, 3:53pm
Not the best pic's but a good idea how they look
http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/5357/pic03bd5.jpg
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by kaizenator on Aug 5, 2006, 4:42pm
They are great tires for M trucks
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by pistolnut on Aug 5, 2006, 9:10pm
I think this is something on a lot of people's minds. I know that I am considering it. It looks pretty simple, but it isn't. The old site had a lot of info about this, but I would like to see someone that has done it and made it work post up with all of the info about what works and what doesn't, what you have to buy, and what a big deal it really is. Also, there is the whole issue of the potential steering problems and such.
Let's talk about this.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Aug 5, 2006, 10:19pm
well....
it's simple... ish, but it's not EASY. Careful examination of one's motives helps here, because you can screw up your truck pretty good w/this particular issue, and it's not really worth it unless you really need to do it.
/rant. hahah
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by dummy on Aug 6, 2006, 4:01pm
Shackle Flip:
1) Chock front tires and jack both rears off ground w/ jack under D70 centersection
2) Remove rear tires
3) Put jackstands directly in front of rear spring hangers or on framerails in front of rear bumper to support rear of truck
4) Lower rear axle (leave jack under centersection)
5) Remove rear breather/brake block so rear line doesn't get overextended
6) Remove spring U-bolts and plates
7) Lower axle to ground (leave on jack - you're just making room for springs to clear backing plates as they're removed)
8) Remove front spring bolt & unbolt shackle from shackle hanger
9) Remove spring w/ shackle attached, flip shackle position, and reassemble
10) You'll need longer rear shocks and you could drop the rear brake line to prevent overextension
*you can't just unbolt the shackle and flip it with the spring still installed because the spring hits the frame mounted shackle pin
As for the spring-over on the front, I haven't done it to an M-715 so I'll let somebody else chime in. It's already got crossover steering, so as long as the drag link doesn't contact the spring you're probably looking at simply welding perches on the top of your axle, and adding longer front shocks and brake lines. You'll probably need a dropped pitman arm to counter bumpsteer and your front driveshaft may need to be lengthened slightly.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by sermis on Aug 6, 2006, 8:27pm
You forgot on the rear, remove the front spring mount from the frame, flip and reattach mount.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by robertcowan on Aug 6, 2006, 10:10pm
i,ve got new longer brake and vent lines cheap
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by jed on Aug 6, 2006, 10:18pm
Batistabomb, I could take some pictures of the spring over lift I did on my truck. Everyone here answered all the questions I had before I started the lift, so I guess It's my turn to give back if your interested.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by jeepistdougiowa on Aug 6, 2006, 10:52pm
Jed,"give back" that's how it works...thanks!
Good photos of flipping the front mount would be a great bonus.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by brute4c on Aug 7, 2006, 10:20am
The tie rod bar does hit in the front....it needs to be mounted upsidedown to clear...welding up the stock mounting holes and redrilling them from the top with the correct size tapered ream will fix that. I remember TmanII, an older member who did a few of these, said the drag link needed to be lengthened by about 2 inches as well...
NOTE: I have never done one.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by jed on Aug 7, 2006, 8:11pm
OK, so here's what I did for the lift on the front end of my truck. New spring perches were welded on the tubes with the same pinion angle as originals. Since my tierod ends were all bad, I bought a new, larger set and then had the new taper cut into the steering arms from the top down. I didn't have to do any mods to the tierod or drag link, they still fit when I was done. I also found a dropped pitman arm that fit my steering box. I had new, longer brake lines and breather tube made at EVCO hose here in Ogden. The drive line will need to be a little longer and of course longer shocks are needed, but I'll wait till the truck is back together so I can get proper measurements. The crossmember with the trans mount needs to be cleareanced a little so the the driveline doesn't hit it. I built a new crossmember since mine was chopped up already, so I've got plenty of room there. Anyway, that about wraps up the front.
http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/739/springover1do6.jpg
http://img474.imageshack.us/img474/7...ngover2wb3.jpg
Here's one of new tierod end on top of steering arm
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/8...ngover3jd2.jpg
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by awest on Aug 11, 2006, 9:09am
Jed where did you get your spring perches at. What is the Axle Diameter for them. Also did you just weld them directly on top of the axle level with the old ones, or did you find your angle.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by jed on Aug 12, 2006, 2:04am
I bought the perches at Boyce Equipment, the same place I bought my truck, but those things are pretty easy to find, they are for a three inch tube. Summit racing has them in their spring section. I welded them directly above the old ones. I did put an angle gauge on the axle to make sure it all stayed the same, and it did.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by saxon on Aug 17, 2006, 10:37pm
jed, where did you find the tapered reamer to fit the taper of the larger tie rod ends? saxon
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by jed on Aug 18, 2006, 9:25pm
My cousin owns his own machine shop here in Ogden and he had the right tapered ream. Worked out very well! He also spun new bushings for the rear leafs.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by fsjsuperswamper on Aug 25, 2006, 11:08pm
In thoughs pics above, that drag link isn't going to hit the spring when you start flexing is it???
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Aug 25, 2006, 11:32pm
Probably not...... springs aren't THAT flexy.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by saxon on Aug 26, 2006, 9:16am
Is there any advantage to swap shackles from front to back? Dan
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Aug 26, 2006, 10:30am
yes, the ride should be a little bit smoother due to the axle moving in the direction the bump wants it to move: backward.
HOWEVER you'll also change your pinion angles and if you drop the front hangers to keep the spring level you'll have "rock fangs" which attract rocks... hehe
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by socal715 on Aug 26, 2006, 12:09pm
Quote: <TABLE class=bordercolor cellSpacing=1 width="90%"><TBODY><TR><TD width="100%"><TABLE class=quote cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD width="100%">Jed where did you get your spring perches at. What is the Axle Diameter for them. Also did you just weld them directly on top of the axle level with the old ones, or did you find your angle.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Dynatrac should have em Mark if you're looking for a pair.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by bigwheelbob on Aug 26, 2006, 6:44pm
I do stock these perches. 11.00 plus the bus fee. 910-326-2881, Bob.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by fsjsuperswamper on Sept 6, 2006, 8:46pm
Would 4" blocks work for the lift in the back?????
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by jed on Sept 6, 2006, 9:29pm
Yes... right or wrong, that's what I did. In my OPINION, spring wrap isn't a real issue because I know for a fact that my little 350 doesn't have enough power to wrap the springs on my Kaiser. I've got a '04 Duramax with lots of extra power and a 4" block in the back , and those springs don't wrap enough to cause any problems at all, so I decided to try it.
Re: spring over/flip shackle conversion
Post by brute4c on Sept 7, 2006, 9:08am
Spring wrap, even with around 450 horse gas motors, isnt a problem in the rear unless one removes more than 2 leaves from the springs or uses non stock springs...