wrecker : 205 T case brake conversion

205 T case brake conversion
Post by wrecker on Jun 16, 2006, 11:28am

I finally found a divorced 205 and I suppose the parking brake conversion Spicer posted is lost? Anybody got that info or done the conversion and have some pics/details? I'll be away from the pc 'till monday but feel free to post up. Any twin stick info would be welcome as well. As that has been debated before, I'll say in advance, I just want to do it 'cause it's kinda cool and it works so wether or not it's an advantage doesn't concern me in the least. Thanks. Bill

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Jun 16, 2006, 12:07pm

Twin stick info is available at www.google.com LOL plenty of pages on that conversion. Do it right, or you'll find out how cool it is to have your axles in different gears. That's pretty cool! SNNNNAAAAAAP heheh

Parking brake conversion is a little harder to get accurate info but not much. High Angle Driveline sells parts for it, or you can rig something if you've got a lathe. You need a mount for the caliper as well, but none of that is really rocket science. Watch your clearances... Spicer managed to uh... clearance his floor when he lost a crossmember hahahahahah

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by robertcowan on Jun 16, 2006, 1:56pm

its a costly conversion to use the stock e-brake parts. i do them but like i said the parts from high angle are priceyand there the only one who sells them . useually about 500.00 time its on the truck. parts alone are well over 300.00 including machineing of your old components.
bob

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Jun 16, 2006, 5:18pm

It can cost MUCH less than that with some digging. I think Spicer's into his for like, $50 or so. Seriously.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by kwai on Jun 16, 2006, 5:54pm

But spicer did his own machining. What's the cost of a mill?

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by robertcowan on Jun 16, 2006, 8:59pm

price the yoke from high angle drive !!!!!! price the companion flange !!!!!!!! seal, e-brake band, etc. better do your homework guys before you talk !!!!!! i do !!!!!
bob

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Jun 16, 2006, 9:16pm

*sigh*

I wasnt' talking about using high-dollar aftermarket parts. I said you can rig something. Breathe! Using calipers is much cheaper. I know people here that are using ATV brakes w/cable activation. ETC ETC

but yes, if you go aftermarket it is going to cost you a bunch of money.


Kwai, yeah, mills aren't free either. That's why I said IF you have a lathe.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by k8icu on Jun 16, 2006, 9:39pm

Didn't Lee do a disk parking brake conversion on his 715 when he dropped the 4BT in? I seem to recal that he used something like a cheby brake and caliper and just welded up the parts to make the thing work. (Foghorn Leghorn voice on) I say I say I could be wrong (voice off). but that is what sticks in my mind. I'm thinking with a little certain ethnic engineering you should be able to make something work for not a lot of cash and paying the big bucks.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Jun 16, 2006, 9:48pm

I think Lee used something expensive... The really important part is the rotor, as far as I'm concerned: getting one that will fit. There are factory Dana/Spicer flanges out there that will work just fine with the right rotor.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by tacomainoh on Jun 16, 2006, 9:53pm

excellent thread here: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=480702 on just this topic.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by fisherman on Jun 17, 2006, 12:57pm

Thanks Tacoma, I just pulled my transfer case out of my donor truck last night. They are tough to catch, tried one handed. I'll be cleaning it up, mocking it up and well see how it comes together. Fisherman

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by robertcowan on Jun 17, 2006, 3:21pm

you get what you pay for on a e-brake setup. i like spicers np200 setup myself and thats what i,am doing. i,am lookin for a cheaper source for the companion flange and yoke. this is the expensive parts. also not bringing up to specs the brake band and re-trueing the brake hubisnt adviseable in my opinion if you want great e-brakes instead of will-do brake. i like to keep the truck as stock as possible even if it costs 100.00 more and thats what were talking about here. nothing like somebody looking at your project and saying what have your RIGGED up here ???? lol

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by robertcowan on Jun 17, 2006, 3:25pm

just another note. i bought a np 202 t-case from barrman and it had took the identicle flanged yoke as a np200 so all the np200 e-brake components work perfect and its a part time t-case. very HD. i,ll be posting pix tuesday of the t-case swap. i,ve got it within 6" of being welded in now. trim a little check it etc ? sure is heavy !!!!
bob

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by fisherman on Jun 17, 2006, 3:58pm

Thanks Bob. I think mine is a np205, although I've heard some internationals came with np202's. It has to much crud on it for me to tell the difference. I believe it is a np205. It came out of a 1970 international 1100 pick up. Anyone need an international engine? Was rebuilt sometime ago, runs decent at least the last time I fired it up. I can't tell what it is, probably just a 345. I think I'm going to keep the axles out of the International for my cj-6 project, wheeling rig. I will be checking in to see what your doing for the e-brake setup. Not sure what will be the easiest for me to do? Fisherman

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by devildog on Jun 18, 2006, 8:25am

For twin stick check out this:

http://jkwoffroad.com/offroadproducts.php#33

You can get new ready to install shift rods so you don't make a mistake. DIY is cheaper of course (unless you screw up) but these save a lot of cut and fit time.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by barrman on Jun 20, 2006, 9:44am

A few things to make clear.

Tom has a disc e-brake on Velvet that he fabbed up for about nothing. It even has its own master cylinder.

His orange truck has the NP200 band e-brake mounted on a NP205.

The 200 brake on a 205 is what Bob sells parts for. Assuming the donor 200 rear output seal is good, then all you need to do is machine the output housing a little to make the 205 bearing fit. A new rear output yoke is needed and a little bit of ingenuity and work is required to make it all fit together. Jesse at High Angle Driveline is where Tom got his yoke. Tom has his own lathe. He couldn't find the reciept when I was at his place in March, but he thinks the yoke was about $30. That was all he had invested in the swap. I also have my own lathe and will be doing the swap real soon. I will take pictures along the way and bore everybody to death.

Basically, if you want it done and don't want to do it, contact Bob Cowen. He will get it done and done right. You won't ever have to mess with it again. If you want to do it yourself, collect the parts and make it yourself. Just don't complain if you have to mess with it a bunch.

The disc stuff on Pirate and other places will work great. But, you get what you pay for and it all boils down to how much you want to pay and do yourself.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by robertcowan on Jun 20, 2006, 1:53pm

i called jesse at high angle and the yoke-& companion flange was a little over 200.00 also there is machineing required for the yoke. a spacer has to be made for the brake drum and a register has to be done for it on the yoke. never reuse a used seal . it will bite you. also retrue the brake drum and reline the band. then your all jamed up ready to rumble.
barrman, i got the np202 installed yesturday.
bob

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by osut362 on Jun 20, 2006, 2:49pm

i put a np205 in my 715 this spring and made up a disc parking brake. it hooks up to the factory brake handle and uses a shortened factory pull rod. i'm in to it for about 150.00 with a new caliper and disc. i converted a pinion mounted parking brake (street rod stuff) to work on the output flange of my 205. it will slide the back wheels at 20 mph, and it's good enough for me. .....al

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by wrecker on Jun 21, 2006, 8:41am

My main goal is to have a brake that works and Tom's get up looked pretty slick and not too difficult. I have access to a lathe and it even comes with it's own operator-lol. I just need to know the basic procedure and I could scratch my head enough and figure it out, but was hopeful that someone had a copy of Tom's file wuith the pics and explanation. It was an excellent sticky. Barrman, you'll be doing us all a favor by re-creating the information that was lost.
osut, you have any pics of your setup?

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by osut362 on Jun 21, 2006, 12:50pm

wrecker, no pictures yet. rotor came from TPI, $35.00, adapter to mount on your specific yoke was about the same amount. caliper came from TSM, $80.00 with pads and the mounting bracket was $10.00 more. i got the LARGE machanical caliper and works well with the rotor. the rest of the stuff i needed i had as scrap. bolts, plates, ect. another thing i has to buy was 2, 1/4 inch clevis. i also made brackets and mounted the caliper before i put the 205 in the truck. i wear bifocals and looking down is easier than looking up caliper pn 7211, caliper bracket pn 7208 rotor pn bp15112 rotor adapter will specific for your yoke

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by brute4c on Jun 21, 2006, 1:02pm

Here are spicers 205 disc ebrake pics...sorry I havent found the text yet:

http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake1.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake2.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake3.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake4.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake5.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake6.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake7.jpg
http://www.m715zone.com/jonmisc/spicer205ebrake8.jpg

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by socal715 on Jun 21, 2006, 1:14pm

Caliper/rotor/master seems like a heck of a lot of work just for a E-brake..... why not just put a line lock in it and be done???

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by elwenil on Jun 21, 2006, 1:36pm

That's Spicerfab. Tom probably did it that way just because he had the junk sitting around and he was bored, lol.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by rpgdeity on Jun 21, 2006, 2:17pm

Line lock is nice to have, but if for some reason you lose hydraulic pressure, then you have no parking brake, or regular brakes. I like having the mechanical T-case brake as a parking and emergency brake. Thinking of the worst possible situation, if you lost hydraulic pressure and also broke a rear driveshaft, then you would really be in trouble. The safest route in my opinion would be a mechanical parking brake that goes to the axle, but since that isn't really an option with the stock 715 rear axle, I think the next best bet is the mechanical T-case brake.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by socal715 on Jun 21, 2006, 2:27pm

Yeah, but if you lose pressure.. you have daddy issues... and you're screwed anyways no matter what you're running.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by brute4c on Jun 21, 2006, 2:30pm

Most states dont call a line lock an emergency brake legally either because it relies on the same fluid as the regular brakes...they want to see a backup system that is totally seperate so that if the primary fails, the backup is still A1.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by socal715 on Jun 21, 2006, 2:41pm

Very good point Jon. However, here in Kalifornia we ran them on our rigs.. but i guess never had anyone ever want to inspect them either.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by bigwheelbob on Jun 21, 2006, 2:48pm

Alot of line locks will loose preasire when left for any length of time also.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by socal715 on Jun 21, 2006, 2:49pm

Yep and they will kill the batteries too. I never used them for any lengthy period of time. I guess im talking about offroad rigs in general.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by brute4c on Jun 21, 2006, 2:51pm

If it is strictly for off road, I think its a great idea....or even if there is a working mechanical ebrake....then one can add a line lock and have the best of everything to pick from...cover all the bases....thats is what I intend to have...................................someday.... .........................

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by barrman on Jun 21, 2006, 2:51pm

The pictures Jon posted were of Velvet the TTC truck. His orange truck, Futura, has the NP200 brake on it. I have some pictures I took of the set up at home. I will post them if I can find them tonight.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by brute4c on Jun 21, 2006, 3:04pm

Yep...those were spicers NP205 pics.

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by barrman on Jun 21, 2006, 7:11pm

The purple 205 with the disc brake is on Velvet. The red 205 with the 200 band brake is on Futura. I was taking pictures of how he mounted it in March. But, you can see the band brake from the 200 in the pictures.

http://img83.imageshack.us/img83/6528/p31201008rz.jpg


http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/9713/p31201010ir.jpg


http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/9883/p31201029mi.jpg


http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/6473/p31201035cz.jpg

Re: 205 T case brake conversion
Post by luckypabst on Jun 23, 2006, 12:15am

I believe a hydraulically operated emergency brake is illegal no matter how you plumb it. Something tells me the DOT requires a 100% mechanical parking brake, otherwise the OEM would not be still using cable controlled E-brake systems.

Chris