Printable View
I know I will probably get laughed at by asking but here I go.
Would a Ford 300 6cyl be worth the time to swap into my M-truck?
I can get a complete engine, wiring etc and a C4 trannie for basically free. (friend has one from a truck he is using as a donor).
I know a V8 would be better, but the $0.00 price tag entices me.
Would the effort to do the swap be worth the gain?
I know that a couple of people have done the Ford 300 swap...one was in a magazine and looked almost fatory...if ya didnt know better you wouldnt know...both people I know that have done it said they had good power and good mileage pickups versus stock and they seem to think it is enough to make the truck where it should have been stock....not overkill but much nicer and more balanced than stock.
I think if you arent looking for the competition level truck and arent worried about having hot rod type acceleration, it is a great choice...I have driven 350 autos in the M715 with stock gearing that were like taking a car and making it a decent hot rod...the 300 will be less than hot rod but definately a capable vehicle, like an average factory setup today, that will have more capability and ease of service, not to mention cheaper to maintain, than the stock truck.
brute4c
as Brute said, it looks ok in there. Think of it this way, you're getting nearly 30% more cubes too. On a stock-type truck I don't see why not. Go for it.
It's what I'm running, though toss the C4. Like Jon said, it looks like it belongs there and has just the right amount of power. Dunno about mileage, I'm running a 4 barrel and haven't made any mileage tests with the new carby. With the old superhuge Holley I was getting about 10mpg on the freeway. With a fuel infected 6 you should be in the 15 mpg range I'd think.
The 300-6 mounts are at the same angle as the Tornado so I carefully removed the frame perches from the frame and moved them around to fit the engine and welded them back up - looks almost OEM. With a T-18 tranny, I had to make an adaptor to go from the stock rubber cushion to the tranny tailhousing - took about 20 minutes to make.
My method only required a conversion U-joint to hook up to the stock jackshaft. The shifter is about 4" farther forward so you have to relocate the hole. The 300 has holes for a clutch crossshaft so I cobbled up a quick engine side pivot that took another 20 minutes.
I began the swap one late Friday morning and by Sunday afternoon I had the sheetmetal back in place and was moving the truck under its own power. Not street worthy finished mind you but good enough that I didn't have to push it around.
Chris
What about matting the Ford to the M715 transmission? Does he need an adaptor? Or is it like a match made in heaven and it bolts right up?
nothing bolts to that freak of a bellhousing.! would be nice though.
Aren't T98 and T18 bolt patterns similar or at least close enough? Could I maybe use the 300, 300 bellhousing and T98?
The T-98 differs in bolt pattern on, I think, the passenger side as the bolt holes are evenly spaced on both sides of the t18, which we can call narrow spacing, and the t98 has wide on the one side, with narrow on the other.
Maybe you would have the room to drill the new bolt hole in the t18's bellhousing but then you gonna have a bunch of input shaft problems and such.
Best bet would be to find a setup from a factory vehicle and get it all at once if possible...using the factory 300 and bellhousing and t18 would be the easiest for parts fit.
brute4c
That is what I was thinking would be the problem. Even if it fit the shafts would be wrong.
I am going to try to put the 300 in with a T-18 and keep the NP200.
It sounds like it will be pretty straight forward or as straight forward as any swap can be.
My only other question then is for for LuckPabst. What did you do for the transfer case shift linkage? Can it bolt to the T-18 (simlar to stock) or did you fab a bracket and mount it somewhere else?
Tcase linkage won't bolt up. I don't remember exactly what I did but it involved using 2 or 3 bolts off the tranny cover to attach a mount. With trans in hand, you'll see what I'm talking about.
Chris
Thanks for the advice.
I am going to start checking for a Ford bellhousing, clutch parts and T-18. I might be asking you some more questions when I get most of the parts together because this will be my first engine swap.
Joel,
One thing I forgot which is probably the biggest headache is trouble hooking up the radiator.
In relation to the crankshaft centerline, the 300 is designed for a lower mounted radiator and the water pump inlet is very low on the engine. I would need a very tight 90 degree radiator hose to make the connection - probably easy to get if I looked hard enough. But to compound matters, I'm using an alternator mount that puts the fan belt right in the center of where the hose needs to go. I had to build a snaky thing that looks like a rudimentary sink drain trap to get around the fan belt.
Apparently though Econolines had an alt. mount that puts it up high on the driver's side and that's what I'll be looking for to clean up my engine.
Wait, theres more - The water pump is mounted so low compared to the 230 that you would only have room for a 12 or 13" fan so plan on an electric fan.
At 100 degrees air temp on the freeway, I'm pushing the limits of the stock radiator too. High rpms and a small radiator aren't real good together. Hopefully I'll get a larger rad. in there before FE.
Nothing too outrageous for a full-on engine swap though.
Chris
Chris: I'll say again that Summit has aluminum deals for $180. Spicer is happy w/his.
Also, van stuff is almost all up high and out of the way. Either that or stuffed on the bottom LOL. Chevy seems to have moved their van stuff up high on the v8's where Ford seems to have doen the opposite. Not sure about the 6cyl. though. Good luck, should work out fine.
Tacoma,
I'll probably look into the Summit deal, I remember him talking about it. First I'm going to see what the radiator shop suggests though. Totally off topic, how do Al radiators hold up compared to standard brass ones as far as flexing in a 4x4? I'm a bit concerned that the Summit ones aren't built to take the off road abuse.
Chris
they used to be advertised in teh circle track section before they ditched it, so I'd guess fine. As always, the mounts are key. I think they come w/big rubber bushings. Lot's of guys here running them in their rockpigs, either rubber mounted in trucks or rigid in tube frames. Seem to be holding up ok? Not a definitive answer by any means, but I think they'll be ok.
LuckyPabst,
You are talking about the stock radiator right? Would you suggest a pusher fan instead of a puller?
Was your alternator mount stock? It is mounted low, but I will have to take a look at the engine again to see how low it is. I am getting the complete engine minus the power stearing pump and bracket. It also has an A/C compressor which I planned on keeping and converting to an air compressor. I could look and maybe I could relocate the alternator to the A/C compressor's location. The A/C compressor is up high on the engine. Maybe I could get lucky and not have to modify the mount.
Yea, stock radiator. I'm running a pusher and it's marginal when you need it most like running in sand or 'wheeling in the heat. I've heard that pullers are more efficient but I didn't have enough room between the radiator and water pump to mount the fan there. You could most likely find a thinner fan. Of course the fan won't make a lot of difference at freeway speeds, this is why I'm thinking about a new radiator.
The alternator mount is stock, mounted low on the passenger side. If anything, a van mount will fix it I think. I'm hoping the 4 bosses on the drivers side are for an A/C-alternator mount. That would kill two birds by putting the alt out of the way and providing a pump for onboard air.
Chris
The A/C compressor is mounted on the driver side so that is probably what they are for.